[Taxacom] Proofs for opinion
stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz
Thu Jan 8 18:40:46 CST 2015
No. Possibly Paul can corfirm this, but, somewhere, there almost certainly WAS AT SOME STAGE a strong implication to the effect that a publication must be registered on Zoobank before it is published electronically. The problem of course is that once it is published without registration, you can't go back in time to preregister it, so it cannot be published electronically. But now Art. 8.5 doesn't seem to say that! Hmmm ...
I think that the meaning of "issued" is actually quite clear, and so that a pre-2011 electronic publication cannot be rendered valid by adding registration etc. In fact, nothing before mid-2012 can be, because the archiving statement could not be made on ZooBank before then. There is published discussion on this point, somewhere.
You say [quote]I think that the earliest reasonable date in that case would be the date on which all requirements were fulfilled[unquote]. But that is the problem! How can you tell on what date a missing LSID was added to a PDF if the publisher doesn't come clean and state that date?
We don't have the same problem with dating paper publications as we have for electronic ones, as I'm sure that your colleague Neal can explain to you. Ever been to a library? Journal issues in libraries have accession date stamps (and librarians have no reason to falsify them). The original idea behind archiving electronic publications was to make such archives the electronic equivalent of libraries, but, because Zootaxa output is faster than archiving can keep up, this requirement got watered down to a mere statement of intent to archive. Hmmm...
On Fri, 9/1/15, Richard Pyle <deepreef at bishopmuseum.org> wrote:
Subject: RE: [Taxacom] Proofs for opinion
To: "'Stephen Thorpe'" <stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>, "'Paul van Rijckevorsel'" <dipteryx at freeler.nl>, taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
Received: Friday, 9 January, 2015, 1:16 PM
> This was my point
from before. Oddly, I can't now seem to find the bit
> thought was in the
Code requiring Zoobank registration BEFORE publication!
> Art 8.5. (below) seems OK from this point
that registration must happen before a work can be
available, because the
registration number (or other evidence of
registration) must be included within the work
itself. Basically, in order
available, an electronic work must ITSELF include:
1. the "date" of publication (which
can be only a year)
2. evidence that
registration has occurred
3. all the other
stuff that is required for both paper and electronic
associated ZooBank record must include:
the intended archive
5. ISSN or ISBN
In my mind, the work becomes
available as soon as all five points are
The real problem that we're dancing around
is not the meaning of the word
"published", but rather the meaning
of the word "issued".
For example, suppose a PDF was put online in
2011, and fulfilled all five
It was not available in 2011, because Art. 8.5.1 says that
must "have been issued after
2011". So, what does "issued" mean?
the PDF was still downloadable
(=obtainable) on 1 January 2012, then is it
considered to have been "issued" on
that date (as well as every other date
the work is obtainable)? I can see arguments both ways.
The word "issue" or
"issued" appears 17 times in the Amended Article
it's not defined in the Glossary
(closest definition is within the
> But 8.5 now opens another can of worms.
Now it looks like a forgotten
> registration can be added in at any stage,
thereby making a valid
> from the date of registration (provided
that the LSID is added to the PDF
> same date)!
I don't think anyone would argue that
retroactively adding a ZooBank number
electronic publication pushes the date of availability (for
of priority) back to the
*registration* date. I think that the earliest
reasonable date in that case would be the date
on which all requirements
That is, the date on which an electronic work with the
ZooBank number included was obtainable
(assuming other criteria met).
> Given that the date of publication cited
in the work itself can be
> incomplete or
incorrect, how can we tell when the Zoobank LSID was
> subsequently added to a PDF? How can we
tell the valid publication date??
Indeed! This is getting to the crux of my
original long post on this
course, we have the exact same problem with paper-based
publications too, so this problem is not
peculiar to electronic
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