[Taxacom] Nomenclatural availability of preliminary electronic versions of taxonomic papers

Stephen Thorpe stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz
Fri Oct 16 20:25:10 CDT 2015


Exactly. On the other hand, errors which I do think require correction include: 

(1) Misidentified host plants;

(2) Misinterpreted localities;

(3) Misattributed characters;

etc.

Unfortunately, there are a significant number of these errors in the literature, and it can be very difficult to publish corrections.

Stephen

--------------------------------------------
On Sat, 17/10/15, Michael A. Ivie <mivie at montana.edu> wrote:

 Subject: Re: [Taxacom] Nomenclatural availability of preliminary electronic versions of taxonomic papers
 To: "Stephen Thorpe" <stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>, "taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu" <taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
 Received: Saturday, 17 October, 2015, 12:50 PM
 
 Exactly, basically, as in all things,
 if no one objects to a common 
 sense violation, it can be treated as valid. Of course there
 are those 
 who think scholarship is discovering these things and using
 them to make 
 a change.
 
 Mike
 
 On 10/16/2015 4:33 PM, Stephen Thorpe wrote:
 > Taking a case to the Commission is not a good way of
 solving minor problems, which tend to be too frequent, and
 would take too long to process, and the outcome would be
 kind of trivial. For example, if, as often happens, someone
 designates a lectotype without stating "here designated" (or
 equivalent), it technically isn't a valid designation.
 However, for all intents and purposes, it is valid. The
 specimen will still be stored as a lectotype in a
 collection, still be treated as the lectotype, and if anyone
 can be bothered re-designating it (hopefully not in a paper
 devoted to the task!), they should (except for very rare
 cases) designate the same specimen. So, what's the @#$!ing
 point??
 >
 > --------------------------------------------
 > On Sat, 17/10/15, Michael A. Ivie <mivie at montana.edu>
 wrote:
 >
 >   Subject: Re: [Taxacom] Nomenclatural
 availability of preliminary electronic versions of taxonomic
 papers
 >   To: taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
 >   Received: Saturday, 17 October, 2015,
 10:42 AM
 >
 >   I agree with Stephen on this, and our
 >   current system for this is the
 >   Commission.  The most important
 role of the Commission
 >   on a day-to-day
 >   basis is to allow that the Code be
 violated for just the
 >   reasons Stephen
 >   wants [Writing a new Code is
 recognized, but separate from
 >   this issue].
 >   The problem is that the process is too
 slow and uncertain as
 >   it stands
 >   now.  The Open Case section of
 the ICZN Website is
 >   years behind
 >   <http://iczn.org/content/list-open-cases> and we
 find
 >   ourselves working
 >   back in an exclusively paper-based
 system of reading and
 >   commenting on
 >   Cases.  The Applications Received
 is the same.  If
 >   you know a Case
 >   number that has appeared in the
 Bulletin, you may not find
 >   it on the
 >   Website. Case 3681 was published in
 the Bulletin (on paper)
 >   in June
 >   2015, but there is no way to see it or
 comment on it
 >   electronically.
 >   There are reasons for this, but the
 fact remains we have
 >   gone back to a
 >   pre-internet system of fixing
 problems.  It therefore
 >   becomes up to the
 >   author on his or her own initiative
 to  "adopt[ed] an
 >   approach whereby
 >   if there is a name which clearly is
 intended to apply to a
 >   taxon, then
 >   we can and should use it for that
 taxon, regardless of any
 >   minor doubts
 >   regarding whether or not the name
 'really is' Code
 >   compliant."
 >
 >   Rich's requirement of a whole new
 approach seems to cry out
 >   even louder.
 >
 >   Mike
 >
 >
 >   On 10/16/2015 3:07 PM, Stephen Thorpe
 wrote:
 >   > At the end of the day, we, as
 taxonomists, should be
 >   primarily concerned with taxa, and
 only secondarily
 >   concerned with their names
 (nomenclature). If one tries to
 >   treat the Code along the lines of a
 legal document, or as an
 >   algorithm, one will quickly end up
 tied up in contradictory
 >   knots. Therefore, I have adopted an
 approach whereby if
 >   there is a name which clearly is
 intended to apply to a
 >   taxon, then we can and should use it
 for that taxon,
 >   regardless of any minor doubts
 regarding whether or not the
 >   name "really is" Code compliant.
 >   >
 >   > Stephen
 >   >
 >   >
 --------------------------------------------
 >   > On Sat, 17/10/15, Richard Pyle
 <deepreef at bishopmuseum.org>
 >   wrote:
 >   >
 >   >   Subject: Re:
 [Taxacom] Nomenclatural
 >   availability of preliminary
 electronic    versions
 >   of taxonomic papers
 >   >   To: "'Roderic
 Page'" <Roderic.Page at glasgow.ac.uk>,
 >   taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
 >   >   Cc: "'John
 Noyes'" <j.noyes at nhm.ac.uk>
 >   >   Received:
 Saturday, 17 October, 2015,
 >   9:17 AM
 >   >
 >   >   <rant>
 >   >
 >   >   The answer has
 always been
 >   >   obvious to
 me.  In the age of the
 >   emerging internet (and
 >   >   yes, it is
 very-much still emerging --
 >   we've only just
 >   >   begun to see the
 changes to
 >   information exchange amongst
 >   >   humans), we need
 to fundamentally
 >   re-think how we establish
 >   >   nomenclatural
 availability (at least
 >   for as long as we
 >   >   continue to use
 Linnean
 >   nomenclature).
 >   >
 >   >   For 250 years,
 the practice of
 >   taxonomy has
 >   >   grown in a
 context where the primary
 >   mechanism of
 >   >   information
 exchange among humans was
 >   ink symbols affixed to
 >   >   "very thin
 slices of wood" (as Paul
 >   Kirk likes to
 >   >   say). For more
 than a hundred years,
 >   the Codes of
 >   >   nomenclature
 have been framed around
 >   that fundamental
 >   >   foundation
 (paper-printed
 >   works).  Now, and in the
 >   >   near-term
 future, the primary
 >   mechanism of information
 >   >   exchange is to
 transmit binary data
 >   encoded in standardized
 >   >   formats (UTF-8,
 JPEG, PDF, etc.) via
 >   the internet.  The
 >   >   Commission had
 to scramble to
 >   accommodate this rapid
 >   >   paradigm shift
 in the form of an
 >   Amendment to the Code, but
 >   >   that was really
 just a temporary
 >   band-aid.
 >   >
 >   >   For the next
 edition of the
 >   >   Code, I
 sincerely hope we can
 >   fundamentally change the way
 >   >   in which new
 names are established and
 >   anchored to
 >   >   biological
 organisms. Specifically,
 >   rather than awkwardly
 >   >   try to force-fit
 our legacy system
 >   (ink-on-paper) into an
 >   >   electronic form
 (e.g., PDFs, with
 >   arbitrary and artificial
 >   >   "pages"), we
 should re-engineer the
 >   entire process
 >   >   in such a way
 that we EMBRACE the
 >   potential for electronic
 >   >   information
 exchange and
 >   management.  The simplest step
 in
 >   >   that direction
 is to de-couple the
 >   scientific notion of
 >   >   "Publication"
 from the legal process
 >   of
 >   >   nomenclatural
 availability.  In
 >   other words:
 >   >   "registered=available".
 >   >
 >   >   The devil is in
 the details, of course
 >   -- and
 >   >   in this case,
 it's about what
 >   "registered"
 >   >   actually
 means.  I'm not talking
 >   about what ZooBank
 >   >   currently
 does.  I'm talking
 >   about a brave new approach
 >   >   that re-crafts
 the rules for
 >   nomenclatural availability into
 >   >   a form that can
 be translated into
 >   pure logical rules that
 >   >   computer
 algorithms can rigorously
 >   enforce.  If done right,
 >   >   Homonymy can be
 eliminated entirely,
 >   Synonymy can likely be
 >   >   reduced (and
 when it exists, much more
 >   easily managed), and
 >   >   we will NEVER
 AGAIN have to argue
 >   about what constitutes a
 >   >   "published work"
 in the sense of the
 >   Code.  This
 >   >   is just the tip
 of the iceberg for how
 >   we can simultaneously
 >   >   improve
 nomenclatural stability AND
 >   increase access to
 >   >   information
 through embracing the
 >   electronic information
 >   >   paradigm, rather
 than futzing around
 >   the edges of it (as we
 >   >   do now).
 >   >
 >   >   </rant>
 >   >
 >   >   Aloha,
 >   >   Rich
 >   >
 >   >
 >   >   >
 >   >   -----Original
 Message-----
 >   >   > From:
 >   >   Taxacom
 [mailto:taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu]
 >   >   On Behalf
 >   >   > Of Roderic
 Page
 >   >   > Sent:
 Friday, October 16, 2015
 >   7:09 AM
 >   >   > To: taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
 >   >   > Cc: John
 Noyes
 >   >   >
 >   >   Subject: Re:
 [Taxacom] Nomenclatural
 >   availability of
 >   >   preliminary
 electronic
 >   >   > versions
 of
 >   >   taxonomic
 papers
 >   >   >
 >   >   >
 >   >   Hopefully eBooks
 (similar to Kindle),
 >   HTML, XML will never
 >   >   be accepted as
 >   >   > pubs under
 the Code
 >   >   because they are
 dynamic.
 >   >   >
 >   >   > And that,
 in a nutshell, is why
 >   some of us
 >   >   despair at the
 current state of
 >   >   >
 >   >   taxonomy. Do we
 really wish that some
 >   of the more innovative
 >   >   means of
 >   >   > publishing
 (never mind what
 >   >   will come in the
 future) are never
 >   accepted.
 >   >   > Never,
 really?
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Regards
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Rod
 >   >   >
 >   >   >
 >   >   ---------------------------------------------------------
 >   >   > Roderic
 Page
 >   >   >
 >   >   Professor of
 Taxonomy
 >   >   > Institute
 of
 >   >   Biodiversity,
 Animal Health and
 >   Comparative Medicine College
 >   >   of
 >   >   > Medical,
 Veterinary and Life
 >   >   Sciences Graham
 Kerr Building
 >   University of
 >   >   > Glasgow
 Glasgow G12 8QQ, UK
 >   >   >
 >   >   >
 Email:  Roderic.Page at glasgow.ac.uk<mailto:Roderic.Page at glasgow.ac.uk>
 >   >   > Tel: 
 +44 141 330 4778
 >   >   >
 Skype:  rdmpage
 >   >   >
 >   >   Facebook: 
 http://www.facebook.com/rdmpage
 >   >   >
 LinkedIn:  http://uk.linkedin.com/in/rdmpage
 >   >   >
 Twitter:  http://twitter.com/rdmpage
 >   >   > Blog: 
 http://iphylo.blogspot.com
 >   >   >
 ORCID:  http://orcid.org/0000-0002-7101-9767
 >   >   > Citations:
 >   >   > http://scholar.google.co.uk/citations?hl=en&user=4Z5WABAAAAAJ
 >   >   >
 ResearchGate https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Roderic_Page
 >   >   >
 >   >   >
 >   >   > On 16 Oct
 2015, at 17:48, John
 >   Noyes
 >   >   > <j.noyes at nhm.ac.uk<mailto:j.noyes at nhm.ac.uk>>
 >   >   wrote:
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Rod,
 >   >   >
 >   >   > What you
 are talking
 >   >   about here
 (E-books etc.) are not
 >   publications under
 >   >   > the ICZN so
 they are not really
 >   relevant.
 >   >   We are only
 talking about e-pubs
 >   >   > that
 >   >   are accepted
 under the current Code.
 >   Hopefully eBooks
 >   >   (similar to
 >   >   > Kindle),
 HTML, XML will
 >   >   never be
 accepted as pubs under the
 >   Code because
 >   >   > they are
 dynamic.
 >   >   >
 >   >   > John
 >   >   >
 >   >   > John Noyes
 >   >   > Scientific
 >   >   Associate
 >   >   > Department
 of Life
 >   >   Sciences
 >   >   > Natural
 History Museum
 >   >   > Cromwell
 Road
 >   >   > South
 >   >   Kensington
 >   >   > London SW7
 5BD
 >   >   > UK
 >   >   > jsn at nhm.ac.uk<mailto:jsn at nhm.ac.uk>
 >   >   > Tel.: +44
 (0) 207 942 5594
 >   >   > Fax.: +44
 (0) 207 942 5229
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Universal
 >   >   Chalcidoidea
 Database (everything you
 >   wanted to know
 >   >   about
 >   >   > chalcidoids
 and more):
 >   >   >
 www.nhm.ac.uk/chalcidoids<http://www.nhm.ac.uk/chalcidoids>
 >   >   >
 >   >   > From:
 Roderic Page
 >   >   [mailto:Roderic.Page at glasgow.ac.uk]
 >   >   > Sent: 16
 October 2015 17:40
 >   >   > To:
 >   >   > taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu<mailto:taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
 >   >   > Cc: Laurent
 Raty; John Noyes
 >   >   > Subject:
 Re: [Taxacom]
 >   Nomenclatural
 >   >   availability of
 preliminary
 >   electronic
 >   >   >
 >   >   versions of
 taxonomic papers
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Isn’t
 part of the issue here
 >   that we are
 >   >   applying one
 notion of locating text
 >   >   >
 >   >   (page number) to
 a situation where the
 >   notion of “page”
 >   >   may be fuzzy at
 >   >   > best?
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Documents
 such as
 >   >   web pages or
 eBooks either don’t
 >   have pages, or the
 >   >   > “page”
 may change depending
 >   on font
 >   >   size, device
 screen, etc.
 >   >   >
 >   >   > People who
 develop software to
 >   annotate
 >   >   web pages, eBook
 pages, etc.
 >   >   > have
 >   >   multiple ways of
 locating bits of
 >   text, such as XPaths
 >   >   [fragments of
 the
 >   >   > HTML or XML
 that may
 >   >   underly the
 document], text fragments
 >   before and
 >   >   > after,
 number of characters into
 >   the
 >   >   document, etc.
 These work, as anyone
 >   >   >
 >   >   highlighting
 text in the Kindle app or
 >   iBooks, or indeed
 >   >   Google Docs or
 Word
 >   >   > will
 attest.
 >   >   >
 >   >   > The nature
 of
 >   >   “publication"
 has changed, so we
 >   need to embrace
 >   >   more
 >   >   > general
 notions of location in
 >   >   documents. This
 is a problem others
 >   have
 >   >   > faced, and
 solved.
 >   >   >
 >   >
 >   >   > Regards
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Rod
 >   >   >
 >   >   >
 >   >   ---------------------------------------------------------
 >   >   > Roderic
 Page
 >   >   >
 >   >   Professor of
 Taxonomy
 >   >   > Institute
 of
 >   >   Biodiversity,
 Animal Health and
 >   Comparative Medicine College
 >   >   of
 >   >   > Medical,
 Veterinary and Life
 >   >   Sciences Graham
 Kerr Building
 >   University of
 >   >   > Glasgow
 Glasgow G12 8QQ, UK
 >   >   >
 >   >   >
 Email:  Roderic.Page at glasgow.ac.uk<mailto:Roderic.Page at glasgow.ac.uk>
 >   >   > Tel: 
 +44 141 330 4778
 >   >   >
 Skype:  rdmpage
 >   >   >
 >   >   Facebook: 
 http://www.facebook.com/rdmpage
 >   >   >
 LinkedIn:  http://uk.linkedin.com/in/rdmpage
 >   >   >
 Twitter:  http://twitter.com/rdmpage
 >   >   > Blog: 
 http://iphylo.blogspot.com<http://iphylo.blogspot.com/>
 >   >   >
 ORCID:  http://orcid.org/0000-0002-7101-9767
 >   >   > Citations:
 >   >   > http://scholar.google.co.uk/citations?hl=en&user=4Z5WABAAAAAJ
 >   >   >
 ResearchGate https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Roderic_Page
 >   >   >
 >   >   > On 16 Oct
 2015, at
 >   >   16:33, John
 Noyes
 >   >   > <j.noyes at nhm.ac.uk<mailto:j.noyes at nhm.ac.uk>>
 >   >   wrote:
 >   >   >
 >   >   > The page
 >   >   number must
 definitely be fixed.
 >   Otherwise it might become
 >   >   a
 >   >   > nightmare,
 or at best a
 >   confusing
 >   >   pain, to give a
 meaningful citation to
 >   a
 >   >   >
 nomenclatural act in on-line or
 >   even hard
 >   >   copy
 databases/catalogues,
 >   >   > especially
 >   >   where longer
 publications are
 >   concerned. That is the
 >   >   absolute crux
 >   >   > of the
 matter. If the
 >   >   text and other
 associated details
 >   remain the same then I
 >   >   > have
 absolutely no problem. It is
 >   the
 >   >   change in page
 number between early
 >   >   >
 >   >   pubs and final
 pubs that makes all the
 >   difference!
 >   >   >
 >   >   > John
 >   >   >
 >   >   > John Noyes
 >   >   > Scientific
 Associate
 >   >   >
 >   >   Department of
 Life Sciences
 >   >   > Natural
 >   >   History Museum
 >   >   > Cromwell
 Road
 >   >   > South
 Kensington
 >   >   >
 >   >   London SW7 5BD
 >   >   > UK
 >   >   >
 >   >   jsn at nhm.ac.uk<mailto:jsn at nhm.ac.uk>
 >   >   > Tel.: +44
 (0) 207 942 5594
 >   >   > Fax.: +44
 (0) 207 942 5229
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Universal
 >   >   Chalcidoidea
 Database (everything you
 >   wanted to know
 >   >   about
 >   >   > chalcidoids
 and more):
 >   >   >
 www.nhm.ac.uk/chalcidoids<http://www.nhm.ac.uk/chalcidoids>
 >   >   >
 >   >   >
 -----Original
 >   >   Message-----
 >   >   > From:
 Taxacom [mailto:taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu]
 >   >   On Behalf
 >   >   > Of Laurent
 Raty
 >   >   > Sent: 16
 October 2015 16:21
 >   >   > To:
 >   >   > taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu<mailto:taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
 >   >   > Subject:
 Re: [Taxacom]
 >   Nomenclatural
 >   >   availability of
 preliminary
 >   electronic
 >   >   >
 >   >   versions of
 taxonomic papers
 >   >   >
 >   >   > On
 10/16/2015 03:47 PM, Scott
 >   Thomson
 >   >   wrote:
 >   >   >
 >   >   > In
 >   >   response to
 Laurent. I agree there
 >   seems to be no real and
 >   >   absolute final
 >   >   > version if
 you count the
 >   >   adding of #tags
 as a part of the
 >   document.
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Well, I
 think that,
 >   >   ideally, it
 should (have) be(en)
 >   possible for the user to
 >   >   > assess the
 integrity of a work
 >   distributed
 >   >   electronically.
 If a publication had
 >   >   >
 >   >   been defined as
 a given distributed
 >   file, with a fixed
 >   >   sequence of
 bytes, this
 >   >   > would
 (have)
 >   >   be(en) fully
 straightforward--all it
 >   requires is that a
 >   >   checksum
 >   >   > value be
 released together
 >   >   with the
 original work. This is fairly
 >   standard
 >   >   > practice
 for other types of
 >   files
 >   >   distributed
 through the Internet.
 >   >   >
 >   >   Assessing the
 integrity of a "content
 >   and layout",
 >   >   if the file is
 allowed to
 >   >   > change, is
 at
 >   >   best a
 nightmare.
 >   >   >
 >   >   >
 >   >   OTOH, I'm not
 sure there's a real,
 >   deep, qualitative
 >   >   difference
 between
 >   >   > allowing
 file
 >   >   alteration as a
 result of a change in
 >   a download date and
 >   >   ip
 >   >   > address
 added to the footer, and
 >   >   allowing file
 alteration as a result
 >   of a
 >   >   > change in a
 page number added to
 >   the
 >   >   header.
 >   >   > Thus if you
 *must* allow the
 >   >   file to change,
 is it really worth the
 >   effort to
 >   >   > require
 that the page numbers be
 >   >   fixed...?
 >   >   >
 >   >   > L -
 >   >   >
 >   >   _______________________________________________
 >   >   > Taxacom
 Mailing List
 >   >   >
 >   >   Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu<mailto:Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
 >   >   > http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
 >   >   > The Taxacom
 Archive back to 1992
 >   may be
 >   >   searched at:
 >   >   > http://taxacom.markmail.org<http://taxacom.markmail.org/>
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Celebrating
 28 years
 >   >   of Taxacom in
 2015.
 >   >   >
 >   >   _______________________________________________
 >   >   > Taxacom
 Mailing List
 >   >   >
 >   >   Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu<mailto:Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
 >   >   > http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
 >   >   > The Taxacom
 Archive back to 1992
 >   may be
 >   >   searched at:
 >   >   > http://taxacom.markmail.org<http://taxacom.markmail.org/>
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Celebrating
 28 years
 >   >   of Taxacom in
 2015.
 >   >   >
 >   >   >
 >   >   _______________________________________________
 >   >   > Taxacom
 Mailing List
 >   >   >
 >   >   Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
 >   >   > http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
 >   >   > The Taxacom
 Archive back to 1992
 >   may be
 >   >   searched at:
 >   >   > http://taxacom.markmail.org
 >   >   >
 >   >   > Celebrating
 28 years
 >   >   of Taxacom in
 2015.
 >   >
 >   >   _______________________________________________
 >   >   Taxacom Mailing
 List
 >   >   Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
 >   >   http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
 >   >   The Taxacom
 Archive back to 1992 may
 >   be
 >   >   searched at: http://taxacom.markmail.org
 >   >
 >   >   Celebrating 28
 years of
 >   >   Taxacom in
 2015.
 >   >
 >   >
 _______________________________________________
 >   > Taxacom Mailing List
 >   > Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
 >   > http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
 >   > The Taxacom Archive back to 1992
 may be searched at: http://taxacom.markmail.org
 >   >
 >   > Celebrating 28 years of Taxacom
 in 2015.
 >
 >   --
 >   __________________________________________________
 >
 >   Michael A. Ivie, Ph.D., F.R.E.S.
 >
 >   Montana Entomology Collection
 >   Marsh Labs, Room 50
 >   1911 West Lincoln Street
 >   NW corner of Lincoln and S.19th
 >   Montana State University
 >   Bozeman, MT 59717
 >   USA
 >
 >   (406) 994-4610 (voice)
 >   (406) 994-6029 (FAX)
 >   mivie at montana.edu
 >
 >   _______________________________________________
 >   Taxacom Mailing List
 >   Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
 >   http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
 >   The Taxacom Archive back to 1992 may
 be searched at: http://taxacom.markmail.org
 >
 >   Celebrating 28 years of Taxacom in
 2015.
 >
 >
 
 -- 
 __________________________________________________
 
 Michael A. Ivie, Ph.D., F.R.E.S.
 
 Montana Entomology Collection
 Marsh Labs, Room 50
 1911 West Lincoln Street
 NW corner of Lincoln and S.19th
 Montana State University
 Bozeman, MT 59717
 USA
 
 (406) 994-4610 (voice)
 (406) 994-6029 (FAX)
 mivie at montana.edu
 
 



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